Can we do something about the team damage?

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evirdrevo
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Re: Can we do something about the team damage?

Post by evirdrevo » Mon Nov 16, 2020 5:20 pm

I'd say limit fops to lvl 3 on oasis, so the arty is the regular one but you can still do the double airstrike. Airstrikes require more timing and skill and their duration isn't 20 seconds.

As some pointed out, playing eng smg is already impossible as it is and some td fopses acquire is due to teammates hungry for kills. When pushing out the last seconds before spawn I do not care at all if I run into an arty, I will even do it on purpose if certain fopses are spamming the same spot all game long.

c0rnn
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Re: Can we do something about the team damage?

Post by c0rnn » Mon Nov 16, 2020 6:22 pm

Lvl3 fops = more airstrikes & artillery, lvl4 = recognize disguised enemies.

S3AL
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Re: Can we do something about the team damage?

Post by S3AL » Mon Nov 16, 2020 7:15 pm

My suggestion, if you limit the fops to lvl2 fop, you should limit all classes to lvl2 class. Everyone should take a hit. In terms of team damage and recklessness.. yes limiting fops will will have the biggest positive impact and playing allies wont be a nightmare for everyone whos not very skilled. And you might create a lot of room to reduce that TD limit cap - obviously 90% of td kicks are fops related, so there is a clear problem there yeah. I still stand very strong on making that TD limit way stricter, and it probably wont look very strict anymore if everything goes down to lvl2.

Do you think anyone would even notice if you limit everything to lvl2 besides monty, qpap, veltins? Maybe you should just do that, unannounced limit. Leave it for 2 weeks, check the TD kick log and see if we've improved smth or not. I dont see the danger in testing stuff on the server for 2 weeks this way, if people are unhappy about smth they'll say it, they aint gonna quit the game thats for sure.
Last edited by S3AL on Mon Nov 16, 2020 7:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.

c0rnn
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Re: Can we do something about the team damage?

Post by c0rnn » Mon Nov 16, 2020 7:19 pm

I'd only limit it to lvl2 if it was the 3rd map, and other admins need to agree with changing the map rotation.

S3AL
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Re: Can we do something about the team damage?

Post by S3AL » Mon Nov 16, 2020 7:40 pm

Why not make oasis the first map in rotation, so all players start from 0. The order of 'nightmare' maps by difficulty for allies which heavily increases as spam increases are: 1. Oasis, 2. Fuel, 3. Goldrush. Goldrush is way more airy than either Oasis or Fuel in terms of how 'chokey' the choke points are which you have to pass to get to objective. Look at radar, bunch of lvl4 spam on it, but somehow it works, cos... airy, open, you can dodge the spam because there's enough room to do so.

evirdrevo
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Re: Can we do something about the team damage?

Post by evirdrevo » Mon Nov 16, 2020 9:00 pm

> Signals Level 3: Improved Air and Ground Support - Your expertise in identifying key enemy targets is rewarded by diverting more fire support resources to your designated targets. Each Air Strike now has two aircraft incoming and each Artillery Strike lasts twice as long.

Aw fuck. The more you know :D

I would only 'fix' oasis. The fops lvl 2 nerf isn't that big a nerf considering how many people are on the server and its huge AOE, especially if you do it at the start of the campaign. What maps have the lvl2 fops atm? Just goldrush or also battery?

c0rnn
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Re: Can we do something about the team damage?

Post by c0rnn » Tue Nov 17, 2020 5:31 am

Goldrush and battery. Goldrush with lvl3 would be a nightmare, and battery too.

evirdrevo
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Re: Can we do something about the team damage?

Post by evirdrevo » Tue Nov 17, 2020 4:16 pm

> In the past we talked about making oasis 3rd map after battery. That and limiting fop to lvl2 like on battery would probably make it less spammy.

Sounds like a good compromise.

S3AL
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Re: Can we do something about the team damage?

Post by S3AL » Thu Nov 19, 2020 3:56 pm

Summary of constructive 'actions' that could be done to reduce Team Damage so far:

- reducing team damage per map (starting with oasis)

- reducing team damage overall - start from 1000 and watch the logs monthly

- reducing fops lvl (8 arty drop), per map, or overall, as it causes most of TD and results in most of TD kicks

- reducing all class-based lvls to lvl2 max

- putting it back to complaints system rather than td limit system

- combination of complaints (voting for complaint after getting tked) & damage overall reduction - cornn says undoable

- (liquid) vote on server to get players opinions

- disabling it overall

Some actions can be combined, eg. liquids vote suggestion with overall reduction to lets say 1000 + fops lvl2 max on oasis. Just giving an example.

December is a good month for gaming with holidays and all shit, if you are gonna put some of these things to action.. december is ideal to get some logs and monitor whether anything works or not.

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GJIROKASTRA
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Re: Can we do something about the team damage?

Post by GJIROKASTRA » Fri Nov 27, 2020 5:53 pm

c0rnn wrote:
Sun Nov 15, 2020 12:37 pm
Clearly only oasis is truly problematic.
i've been pointing out this since quite some time. Ask Crux.

bit of offtop, but if the gameplay quality is on the table I think it's good if I ask about community opinion on this:

I wonder how decreasing the limit of fieldops class players per team to 2 might affect the problem of TD/team balance - reducing the engineers to 3 and coverts to 2 would seem to be too radical, but it is coming to my mind every time I see 4 medic team and problems caused by it. Think about allies second stage on fueldump; 3 coverts sitting on the hill, mortar and eternal ammo provider hidden behind the stone next to cp - basically half of team is doing fuck-all when the rest is getting blasted or crossfired at the walls - ofc they can contribute to victory by just sitting there, but their perfomace/acc must be excellent+, while axis just need to camp and focus not the getting killed in stupid way on fullspawn.
Ofc this way is going against the idea of public server where most of players just want to have fun and enjoy their favourite classes and i fully understand it - but anyone picking up 3rd field ops in team, especially in midst of campaign where there are less than 6 meds in team is just begging for his team to get its ass whooped.
3 fops in one team usually means idiotic contest of who will use binoculars first, or who will get himself wasted (no matter what spawntime is) just to toss the can. And i think that most of people here will agree that single grey ammo pack dropped on actual first line of battle is far more valuable than hundreds of silver ammo pack in spawn.
Panzerfaust/mortar/mg is limited to one per team not only becasue its formidable weapon (given that player know when/how to use it), but also because most of newbs/nerds would be abusing it all of time.
The whole idea is to set a bit more pressure on using medic class - this MIGHT help the teambalacing issue winch can be real pain in the ass these days.

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